Radius M1225 VHF Programming Problem...PLEASE HELP!

[scvfd1204]

Hello everyone!

I have 4 VHF M1225 mobile I am trying to program, and I am having a rather odd problem.

The problem is this. When I plug the programming cable into the mic jack, the radio locks into tranmit mode, and will not come back out. Then the RSS tells me that the radio is not active, and to check all of the connections.

If i disconnect the programming cable from the RIB, and the plug it into the radio, the radio will not lock into transmit until I connect the rib-to-radio cable to the RIB box.

I am using the Polaris II (i think it is) RIB box that works fine on every other motorola unit I have ever programmed in the last 10 years. Also, all 4 of these M1225's is doing the exact same thing.

I am trying to get these radio programmed for my fire department, since the county has decided to change dispatch frequencies once again. We do not want to take these things into a radio shop every time the county decides to change something, which is about every 3 or 4 weeks.

Any help would be GREATLY appreciated!

Thanks

Jeff
Surf City, NC

[Monty]

HI:

I here this often where a person has no trouble
with a Clone Rib and or Cable, changes radios
and sees a problem.

However, since you have had good results with
one series of radio, and then changes, you most
likely have a " Cable Issue " or " Rib Box Issue "

All I can offer is that the " Battery " inside your
Polaris ll may not be charged enough to make it
work, and may be confusing the radio.

I would make sure you have the external power
supply fully charged, and make sure your cables
are OK.

You stand a chance of not only corrupting the Radio
but may damage the Computer as well.

MOST important is to check and make sure the Rib
to Radio cable is wired properly.

If the Cable is wired properly, chances are pretty
high " Part " of the Polaris Rib is not functional any
more.

Monty

[Nand]

We do not want to take these things into a radio shop every time the county decides to change something, which is about every 3 or 4 weeks.

I don’t think the radio shop will mind if you bring these radios in every 3 or 4 weeks. That is what they are there for. You will do both the radio shop and fire department a favor by getting the needed work done correctly with the right equipment.

Now not to piss you off completely, here is what you may look for. Pin 7 on the mic connector is the pin that is used for programming the radio. Pin 6 is the radio’s PTT pin. Could it be that there is a short between the two of these in your cable?

The only two wires needed for programming the radio (at the radio's end) are pin 7 and pin 4 (ground).

Nand.

[kf4sqb]

Also, is the programming cable homebrew, or "professionaly made"? If homebrew, double (and triple!) check the wiring of it. Are any of the other radio's you talked about programming the older Radius line (GM300, Maxtrac, etc...)? If so, are you using the same cable you used for them? If not, try the one you used on them.

[scvfd1204]

The cable I am using is a very well made cable of aftermarket descent. It is the same cable I have used on many MaxTracs, GM300s, CDMs, and just about every other similar style Motorola radio that uses the same cable.

I have changed the batteries inside the Polaris "RIB" box, but nothing changed as far as the problem is concerned. Just to make sure, I tried the same cable on 2 MaxTracs and a CDM and it worked just fine, as usual.

I will check the connections again tomorrow and make sure everything in the mic jacks and the programming cable is ok, and I'm sure the cable end is ok, since it works fine on the MaxTracs and CDMs.

As far as taking the units to the radio shop is concerned, I don;t do that anymore. I used to work for all of them around here, and none of them know what they are doing. Everytime they program something for us, it is always programmed wrong, and the radios are useless to us until it gets corrected, which usually means yet another 45 minute trip (one way) to their shop, jsut to have the radios taken out of major emergency apparatus, and sitting in the radio shop for 2 or 3 days until they can "get around to it", and then have to make yet another 45 minute trip (one way) to pick them up.

I have about 8 years of experience in radio repair, test, installation, programming and maintenance. These are the first M1225s I have yet to program. I personally never really cared for the M1225 all that much. It looks and acts too much like Midland Bantam series mobile to me. Personally, I prefer the MaxTrac, CDM, Spectra, MaraTrac and a few others. I have about 3 or 4 fire departments I do radio work for since I do much better quality and quantity of work than the local radio shops. Most of them arent even technicians anymore. If something doesnt work right, off to the factory it goes (even for a mic replacement). I have been working with electronics all of my life, and radio is much more than a second nature to me to breathing. I perform my own alignments with my personally owned and maintained service monitors and such.

I'm not trying to upset anyone here by any means, but I'm not an amatuer in the radio world.

Thanks for the tips guys. I will check on these things tomorrow. I have had a really long day today, and have some things I need to get caught up on around here before anything else. If you guys happent o think of anything else, please drop me a line!

Thanks again!!

Jeff
Surf City, NC

[kcbooboo]

It's interesting that the radio begins to transmit as soon as you plug the radio cable into the RIB. As Nand pointed out, PTT is on one pin and the programming takes place on a different pin. I don't even think the RIB cares about anything except the programming pin. In fact, you could use a two-wire cable to get the job done.

I'd suspect either a wiring problem at the RIB-end of the cable, or a problem inside the RIB at the radio connector. If you pull the RIB battery, does the radio still go into transmit when you plug it in? Perhaps that RIB has the ability to ground the PTT line, depending on how the connector is wired.

Then again, you say it does not do this on MaxTracs or Radiuses, which are pretty much identical, from the mic jack perspective.

Can you get ahold of a different RIB and try it out? Not much left after that.

Bob M.

[kf4sqb]

To expand a little on kcbooboo's suggestion, can you get ahold of another M1225? Preferablly one from a different original dealer. I wonder if maybe someone has "rerouted" the data pin in the mic jack. I have never seen any such done, but I have heard several people on the board talk about dealers doing such things to try to force people to bring the radio to them only. Maybe they disconnected the data line and paralleled the PTT line onto the data pin?

[Station House Products]

Well, for one, the PA II RIB doen't have an interchangeable battery, per-se. You would have to remove the screws to open the unit and unsolder the nicad batteries inside to replace them. I would try Monty's suggestion first and use a regulated power supply, not battery power to run your RIB. From there, the other suggestions about checking the cable seem the most fitting.

Also, just to clarify, you are running the RSS for the M-1225 in Windows, correect? I saw someone try to run it once out of a DOS shell from the desktop with some pretty interesting results.

Lastly, I know it seems like a far stretch, (but I've seen it happen) check your RIB to computer cable. Something may have gotten pinched or damaged in it and it may be causing your troubles.

Regarding the radio shop, if you have to drop it off, bring a portable along once you pick the units back up just to verify your freqs. and PLs are correct. If they are'nt, insist that the reprogram them right there on the spot and don't leave untill they are done correctly.

Just my $0.02

[scvfd1204]

"To expand a little on kcbooboo's suggestion, can you get ahold of another M1225? Preferablly one from a different original dealer. I wonder if maybe someone has "rerouted" the data pin in the mic jack. I have never seen any such done, but I have heard several people on the board talk about dealers doing such things to try to force people to bring the radio to them only. Maybe they disconnected the data line and paralleled the PTT line onto the data pin?"

As far as rerouting the pins on the mic jack, the radio shop that sold them the radios is no where near being smart enough to do something like that. I wouldn't put it past them to dig deeper into their customers' pockets like these particular shops keep trying to do all the time.

As a matter of fact, these radio shops have a backwards deal going with our county's Emergency Services. They both "agree" to change a PL tone or something countywide, and force the departments themselves to pay for each radio that has to be programmed. Frankly, I hate it, and I wish I could put those radio shops out of business. The fire departments are here to help people in danger and times of need, not just to make a money hungry radio shop prosper.

I havent had a chance to try different things in the past couple of days. My main job has been keeping me busy with lots of new construction and excavation going on. I will look into the matter a little deeper in the next day or so, perhaps this weekend, when I know I will have a couple of days off, except for the fire department.

Thanks again guys!

Jeff
Surf City, NC

[Station House Products]

Hey Jeff,

One other thing to try. Seems a bit far fetched, I'll admit, but make sure the radio is out of scan when you try to program it. Should'nt make a difference, but..... I've seen stranger things happen.

[motorola_otaku]

BUMP

I'm having a similar problem. My radios don't transmit when the cable is plugged in, but they refuse to read or write and give me an "inactive radio" error message. I've tried several radios all with the same result. The same cable/RIB combo reads and writes to Maxtracs and Maratracs flawlessly. The cable is homebuilt from the Batlabs schematic and I've checked and rechecked it to make sure it's wired correctly. The RIB is a Polaris PA-1, powered from a 12v wall wort. And the weird thing is, I do a Comm Test and the radio resets, but still hits me with an "inactive" error message.

I suspect an impedance issue. The cable was originally built from half of an old flat data cable and worked fine, but the wires kept breaking off at the solders on the DB-25. I switched out with half of a CAT-5 cable, and that's when I started having problems.

[Max-trac]

My Polaris would NOT program a P1225, had to borrow a MOTO RIB.
The Polaris has been fine on all other radios I tried.
Maybe there is a different wiring for the 1225 and Polaris

[scvfd1204]

Max,

I finally got it to work by building another cable. It seems that that particular brand of 8-pin modular connector did not have quite enough pin contact in the radio plug for the programmer to work.

After building another cable using the scehmatic for the Radius/MaxTrac series and it worked after a couple of tries. I just have to make sure the connector seat correctly into the radio.

One of the problems I was having was with the computer originally. I had to use a much older laptop with o much older version of Windoze 3.1 in order for the software to work. Kind of odd, but that's part of the radio programming side of things at times.

I'm glad the Motos I deal with arents as picky as the Kenwoods my department has a few of.

I appreciate all of the help guys.

Thanks

Jeff
Surf City, NC

[motorola_otaku]

Well, in my case, it turned out to be the Polaris RIB. I borrowed a Moto RIB and it read and wrote just fine. Who knows?

[Will]

We had to do some mods on the Polaris (so called) RIB to make it compatabile with 1225's and Spectras.

[motorola_otaku]

We had to do some mods on the Polaris (so called) RIB to make it compatabile with 1225's and Spectras.

What I don't get is, why did it all of a sudden just decide not to work with the 1225s anymore? I've used that same cable and RIB combo for a couple of years now with absolutely no problems. Oh well. Guess it's time to shell out the big bucks and get a real RIB.

[raymond345]

We use motorola programming
parts all the time. We have had trouble
with the M1225 and it was always the
RJ45 plug for the mic.It SUCKS.
It is the number one FAULT with
the M1225 mobiles that need repair.

[wavetar]

We had to do some mods on the Polaris (so called) RIB to make it compatabile with 1225's and Spectras.

What I don't get is, why did it all of a sudden just decide not to work with the 1225s anymore? I've used that same cable and RIB combo for a couple of years now with absolutely no problems. Oh well. Guess it's time to shell out the big bucks and get a real RIB.

Who knows? I had one a few years back that suddenly decided it didn't like MCS2000 radios. Programmed many of them before that, then one day it quit. It eventually quit altogether, I replaced it with a genuine M unit.

Todd