XTS3000 Radio Internals Swap for better flash...Opinions?

[unleashedff248]

I'm looking to swap the internals of two radios, one with a bad display but good flashcode and Host/DSP numbers into one that's fully functioning but has a low end flash and older DSP/Host. The radios are both N DSP's, so that's compatible.

Am I going too far for a better flashcode? Is there an easier way to do this without paying hundreds upon hundreds for flash upgrades? Has anyone ever done it? And most importantly....will I end up in jail for doing this??? Seems like most everything else with the big M will get you there these days...

Oh and just real quick...I'm new here and I read a lot about this Nick character. What did he do to piss everyone off so bad, including Motorola? I know it has something to do with re-flashing radios. I just want to know so that I never get caught up in some stuff like that...

Thanks guys.

[Rayjk110]

No no, you won't end up in jail. Yes, you could swap the "Vocoder Board". They're sold plainly here and on eBay with varios hosts/DSP/flashes. (Sometimes seen as "1mb vocon dsp8")

What Nick did was a different story. He legitimately bought the parts to make the radios, flashsed [whored] them, and sold them for a low cost (well, lower than buying it direct). Motorola had a fit, and, well.... let's just say he doesn't do that anymore. (Search here for the thread)

Anyways, it would probably just be simpler to swap displays rather than the whole entire "guts" of the radios. It involves alot less work.

[nmfire10]

Couldn't you just put the good display into the good radio?

[Elroy Jetson]

Nick found a way to buy all the assemblies necessary to build complete radios, from Motorola, and was building them and
selling them for a profit. You shouldn't be able to do that but he found and exploited loopholes in Motorola's parts pricing
structure that made it possible.

He also found a way to insert a very usable feature set into the radios. And the radios didn't come with authentic
Motorola serial numbers as Motorola never assigned serial numbers to them.

This caused Motorola to drag out the rabid dogs. (We call them lawyers in some states.)

Some people got in a bit of trouble for having Nick radios, too. So they weren't happy, either.


Elroy

[PhillyPhoto]

Couldn't you just put the good display into the good radio?

A much quicker solution. And if needed, a case swap, or pick one up of ebay. They can be had for about $40. Makes them look shiny new .

As far as the details of your question. The DSP is located on the bottom below the controller (the long one the display/keypad attach to). That is if you don't have an encryption board, which would be in between the 2. The controller is what stores everything about the codeplug, including the flashcode. So, you can not swap controllers without getting the firmware that goes with it. There are ways to swap the codeplugs, but it's not my place to say how, as tools used in the process are not meant for public use (hint, look at what type of requests are made in the ASTRO forum).

As far as Nick goes, like Elroy said, he bought the parts and put radios together. It would be like someone buying all the parts for a Toyota Camry, and putting them together and selling it. Technically it would run, but it would have no VIN have no warranty, and Toyota wouldn't be happy about it.

[Elroy Jetson]

Yeah, except that in that case, Toyota probably WOULD be happy. Because a car that sells for 28,000 dollars on the showroom floor will take abou 125,000 dollars to buy a piece at a time!


Elroy

[unleashedff248]

Ok, I get the Nick thing now. I thought he just whored out flashcodes, but this goes far beyond that. I'd never be able to do that. I've never even opened an XTS up. My whole background is with HT, CDM, and MTSX series, as well as Minitors. So far the XTS is the best radio I've owned, and I think I caught the Astro fever. The regular H37 flash is not good enough for me anymore.

The problem with swapping displays is that the case is shot, beat to death, FUBAR, etc etc etc. And in addition it's missing the PTT button and the other buttons are not as nice as the new ones on my other XTS. Will the PTT button and other controls come with the controller or is it a separate module? I figured there's a separate board for the radio controls and all, one that is the same regarless of band, flash, options, etc. Then there's the PA board and the controller, which are optiona and frequency specific. There may be some more stuff in there, but that's all I need to worry about I believe. As for adding an encryption board, does that require any flash options? I'm not set up for hardware or software multikey but I'd like securenet in addition to the already installed Astro P25.

I've seen requests for reflashing radios, and I've seen tons of whored out flashcodes. Is this a taboo thing or can we talk about it? I'm interested in how people get their hands on whore-codes and updated Host/DSP files. I know the whole smartrib thing...but I hear that you don't need one anymore to flash upgrade. Is this true? If I'm not supposed to talk about it then disregard and I apologize, I'm just a newbie with the flash radios.

Thanks for all your help guys.

-Dave

[Rayjk110]

One more thing to check if you swap cases....are both radios AN (or both BN) revisions? There are 2 different flex connectors, respectively, and they're not interchangeable [the plug size is different]. The tell-tale sign of a BN 3k case is the ABC switch sticker is "half-moon" shaped, while the AN case ABC sticker is rather oval-ish in shape. The BN "XTS3000" Sticker also is sorta half-moon shaped. (Altho not as much as the ABC sticker...)

[PhillyPhoto]

The problem with swapping displays is that the case is shot, beat to death, FUBAR, etc etc etc. And in addition it's missing the PTT button and the other buttons are not as nice as the new ones on my other XTS. Will the PTT button and other controls come with the controller or is it a separate module? I figured there's a separate board for the radio controls and all, one that is the same regarless of band, flash, options, etc. Then there's the PA board and the controller, which are optiona and frequency specific. There may be some more stuff in there, but that's all I need to worry about I believe. As for adding an encryption board, does that require any flash options? I'm not set up for hardware or software multikey but I'd like securenet in addition to the already installed Astro P25.

I've seen requests for reflashing radios, and I've seen tons of whored out flashcodes. Is this a taboo thing or can we talk about it? I'm interested in how people get their hands on whore-codes and updated Host/DSP files. I know the whole smartrib thing...but I hear that you don't need one anymore to flash upgrade. Is this true? If I'm not supposed to talk about it then disregard and I apologize, I'm just a newbie with the flash radios.

If the radio functions fine besides the display and PTT button, what I would personally do is send the radio out and get the display replaced and buy a new case. This way you'll have two XTS'. The new displays require a firmware refresh (Host 7.71/DSP 8.03), but it's included when you buy one. So for about $150 ($100 for the display/firmware, $50 for the case), you can get it back up and running. That's just my opinion though.

As far as encryption goes, boards can be had usually for under $100. Make sure you know what firmware that it comes with, as it usually has to be matched to the firmware in the radio. The newer firmware for XTS3000 boards is around 3.53. The radio supports encryption "out of the box", but if you're using multikey, then you'd need a flash upgrade.

The whored flashcodes are only "taboo" because it takes some advanced knowledge, because if you don't know what your doing, you can make your radio into a paperweight very quickly. And once again, the tools to do it are not publicly available. You still need a smartrib to flash the older ASTRO radios (Saber, 3K, Spectra, etc), but the newer ASTRO25 radios (XTS/XTL5000, etc) do not require any type of ribs for programming.

I hope this answers some of your questions. If you don't mind me asking, what are the model numbers/flashcodes in the radios you have now?

[unleashedff248]

Both of my VHF radios are BN versions. The first is H09KDH9PW7BN with a Host R5.60.00 and DSPN6.05.02, flashcode 1000010000007. The second with the busted display and case is also H09KDH9PW7BN, unknown DSP and Host (haven't gotten it in yet), and flashcode 5900010018009. My UHF XTS3K is H09SDH9PW7BN, R07.03.00, DSPN07.03.12, and a whored-out flashcode of 591008-4F1E00-9. I bought it from someone else, I didn't flash it myself.

I may think about the recase/repair. I'm just so afraid of all the you-know-what that's going on in El Motorola (dis)service shop that I don't want to send anything there. The flashcode on the surplus broken VHF XTS is legit, so no worries there (although I hear stories of good, legit flashes coming back with H37 packages only).

Sorry to be asking so many questions, but your help is wonderful. If these were your radios, what you YOU do? I've never sent anything to Moto to get repaired, so I don't know what to expect.

And by the way I never asked for/tried to sell RSS or CPS. But apparently I have a warning. Great.

Thanks again,

Dave

[akardam]

If these were your radios, what you YOU do? I've never sent anything to Moto to get repaired, so I don't know what to expect.

Well, I wouldn't send my radios to El Paxico, even over my dead body.

As others have suggested, simply buying a new case and display from Motorola and installing it yourself or having someone help you with it, is a good way to go. There are many people here on the board with the knowledge to replace the parts. Some of them may even be in your area. You may want to inquire further before considering sending your units off to the depot.

[nmfire10]

Let me make sure I have this straight before I make some suggestions:

Radio #1:
Bad display
Bad case
Good hardware & software

Radio #2
Good display
Good case
Old hardware & software

Take all the hardware out of #1 and put it into #2. That will leave you with a pile of junk in one corner and good radio in the other corner.

[unleashedff248]

Let me make sure I have this straight before I make some suggestions:

Radio #1:
Bad display
Bad case
Good hardware & software

Radio #2
Good display
Good case
Old hardware & software

Take all the hardware out of #1 and put it into #2. That will leave you with a pile of junk in one corner and good radio in the other corner.

Exactly. I don't think I need two radios. I guess I could always sell one...It all comes down to $$$. I'm still debating...

[unleashedff248]

Ok last question (well 3, but who's counting?):

#1. I see some stuff about using S-rec's and possibly unpacked codeplugs with lab software to move flashcodes and (maybe???) Host and DSP. Seems to make sense, if you can get your hands on the s/w to do it. So say I find the s/w (MTSX lab or Astro lab?). Will reading and writing the s-rec from one radio take the flash and Host/DSP with it to another? It's really only the flash I'm interested in. I'd imagine the radios would have to be of the exact same spec's (same model #'s) and at least similar host/dsp's. I'm worried about bricking my radio though, and I don't know enough about this to justify taking the chance...

#2. As previously described, can I take the vocon out of any XTS3000 and put it in mine, or is it band specific/model specific?

#3. I can't get the channel selector on the RMN5021B RSM to work with my XTS3K. When I turn the radio on with it attached I get an error tone (low pitched tone, maybe 500ms long) and the channel automatically switches to channel #2 in whatever zone the radio was in. Then the selector won't work at all. I need to move the one on the radio to switch back to whatever channel I want it to be on. The volume buttons and PTT work fine. I didn't see anything in the CPS either, and I have the latest version (just bought it). Any ideas?

THANK YOU for all of your help guys! You've really taught me a lot about my new radios and helped me use them in the best way possible. I rely on my radio every day for safety and communications at work and at home. This site has made my understanding of the XTS series a lot better than it ever could've been without.

-Dave

[PhillyPhoto]

#2. As previously described, can I take the vocon out of any XTS3000 and put it in mine, or is it band specific/model specific?

#3. I can't get the channel selector on the RMN5021B RSM to work with my XTS3K. When I turn the radio on with it attached I get an error tone (low pitched tone, maybe 500ms long) and the channel automatically switches to channel #2 in whatever zone the radio was in. Then the selector won't work at all. I need to move the one on the radio to switch back to whatever channel I want it to be on. The volume buttons and PTT work fine. I didn't see anything in the CPS either, and I have the latest version (just bought it). Any ideas?

#2 - The vocon is the same as the controller in the XTS3000, it doesn't matter what you put it into, as long as you know the differences (i.e. putting a model 3 in a model 2 case, you won't be able to use radio lock, hot keypad etc). What does matter is the RF board. If you take a controller from say a low split UHF and put in one with a high split, the radio will recognize the error and spit an error code at you (I'm not sure which one off hand). But if you are going from 1 model 3 VHF to another, it won't matter.

#3 - it might be something wrong with the knob. Bring the radio into self-test and when it gets to the end and says "RF TEST" press the purple button on the side until it says "CH TEST" and push the orange button. It will give you two numbers in the form of "3/ 1". Turn the channel selector through the different channels. channel 1 will show up as "4/ 0" and 16 will be "4/ 15". If it shows different values, it might be the knob, and a simple case swab should fix it.