Install opinions - Radios/Lights in EMA vehicles

[emcom]

We are planning on doing some equipment installs on some of our vehicles at work. Specifically, we need to add 1 VHF, 1 UHF, and 1 800 Smartnet II mobile to the vehicles as well as lights, PA/Siren, and corner strobes.

The vehicles are: 2001 Silverado Ext Cab pickup and 2004 Chevy Trailblazer. Both are local govt. vehicles. A 3rd vehicle will be ordered new, but we are not sure what make/model we will get at this time. Our 4th vehicle is a mini van and will likely not have much equipment installed in it except for the existing Southern Linc setup. Our 5th vehicle is on order. It is a 2005 3/4 ton with the Tactical Emergency Asset Management module on back.

Here is what I have now in the truck: Southern Linc mobile, Vhf/Uhf ham rig, and Syntor X Vhf 16 channel (been in our vehicles since 1986)...all put into a generic Galls console.





We want to replace with the following:

1 PM400 VHF 45 Watt 64 Channel (prog w 2M ham freqs too)
1 PM400 UHF 40 Watt 64 Channel (prog w 70cm ham freqs too)
1 LCS2000 Smartnet II 800 Radio
1 Jotto desk console (?)

We looked at going with more expensive radios, but the difference in paying $550 for the PM400 vs. $1,500 for a nice MCS2000 was very significant! We are also getting a car mount kit for our Southern Linc portables and doing away with the monthly fees associated with the mobile radios.

The trailblazer has nothing in it right now except the car mount S/L kit in it. We are going to try to remote mount the other radios somehow. It is a difficult vehicle to work with.

Here is the TEAM vehicle (will not have these graphics on it!):




Our vehicles have to be ready to respond to any area of the state for disaster work, as we are part of our state's response team. We need the radios for use on our local, state, and mutual aid channels. We learned a great deal from the last round of hurricanes when we were working on the opposite end of the state.


We are adding the following lights/siren equipment:

corner strobes
911ep ls12 red led bar in front window
911ep ls28 red led bar in rear window
Tomar 940 siren & light controller


Any comments or suggestions on these items?

Radio equipment good or not good?
Tomar touchpad controller/siren any good?


Thanks,

Scott
Huntsville, Alabama

[apco25]

Looks good so far.

I'd keep the Southern Linc mobiles for better coverage than the handhelds in or out of a converta-com could provide.

The tomar stuff is nice, but I would look at the current Whelen LED offerings and the serial controlled B-LINK MPC01 series of light/siren controllers. Whelen CENCOMM is also nice or for a more traditional intergrated siren, FS Smartsirens are also nice.

Since these are marked units why not utilize a light bar as well? Whelen's LED are extremely low profile and bright like the Liberty or Patriot bar. Add in headlight flasher and corner strobes and you will have an effective warning system.

I'm a high power person so I'd try to find 110w mobiles depending upon your needs. Like new MCS2000 110w models can be had for $700-900 these days. Kenwood 90 series mobiles are also a good choice.


Good luck on the trailblazer - they are major paint to mount anything. In that class of vehicle the Ford Explorer would have been a much friendly vehicle for equipment installation.

[mike m]

With the ICOM radio one important thing to do is to turn the time out timer on set for around 1 minute, especially if running high power. The Pa's in those radios are notorious for crapping out .


Mike

[emcom]

With the ICOM radio one important thing to do is to turn the time out timer on set for around 1 minute, especially if running high power. The Pa's in those radios are notorious for crapping out .


Mike

Thanks for the advice! I've been wanting a new radio Seriously, I think we will program in the most commonly used repeaters and simplex freqs in each band and get rid of the Icom. It has horrible audio anyway.

[emcom]

Looks good so far.

I'd keep the Southern Linc mobiles for better coverage than the handhelds in or out of a converta-com could provide.

I've had problems with my Southern Linc mobile losing signal BEFORE my handheld!

The tomar stuff is nice, but I would look at the current Whelen LED offerings and the serial controlled B-LINK MPC01 series of light/siren controllers. Whelen CENCOMM is also nice or for a more traditional intergrated siren, FS Smartsirens are also nice.

Our police department uses Smartsirens and vision bars. They are getting rid of them. The vision bars are taking a lot of amps to run and have a lot of maintenance problems. The smartsirens sound like a child's toy in the yelp mode.

Our local Whelen dealer switched to Tomar products. I liked the old whelen stuff. The newer high pitched stuff sounds kinda odd. I'm more fond of PA300, Code3, North American Signal, or SVP sirens.

Since these are marked units why not utilize a light bar as well? Whelen's LED are extremely low profile and bright like the Liberty or Patriot bar. Add in headlight flasher and corner strobes and you will have an effective warning system.

My boss is allergic to lightbars . He did not want them for some reason. We were offered some vector bars for free, but we decided not to use them due to high amps needed. I do like the low profile whelen led bars. Our troopers run them here. I also like the looks of Tomar's led bar.

I'm a high power person so I'd try to find 110w mobiles depending upon your needs. Like new MCS2000 110w models can be had for $700-900 these days. Kenwood 90 series mobiles are also a good choice.

Wish we could find one around here for $700-900. Our state contract is 15% off list price for them. Not sure what list price is for a Model I.

Good luck on the trailblazer - they are major paint to mount anything. In that class of vehicle the Ford Explorer would have been a much friendly vehicle for equipment installation.

You're right on that one!!!

Thanks for the well thought out reply. I appreciate your help!

Scott

[SlimBob]

Looks good so far.

I'd keep the Southern Linc mobiles for better coverage than the handhelds in or out of a converta-com could provide.

I've had problems with my Southern Linc mobile losing signal BEFORE my handheld!

Probably has a lot to do with antenna aperature and gain. The mobile antennas can be useful to have gain, but your 1/4 wave or 1/2 wave portable's ducky may have a broader coverage but less distance coverage. The mobiles are probably more useful on the interstate, or on a mountain top. Otherwise a lower gain antenna (like the universal chrome nut Kulrod) may be best for Southern Linc.

Our local Whelen dealer switched to Tomar products. I liked the old whelen stuff. The newer high pitched stuff sounds kinda odd. I'm more fond of PA300, Code3, North American Signal, or SVP sirens.

The Tomar Neobe lights are dazzling to say the least.

Since these are marked units why not utilize a light bar as well? Whelen's LED are extremely low profile and bright like the Liberty or Patriot bar. Add in headlight flasher and corner strobes and you will have an effective warning system.

My boss is allergic to lightbars . He did not want them for some reason. We were offered some vector bars for free, but we decided not to use them due to high amps needed. I do like the low profile whelen led bars. Our troopers run them here. I also like the looks of Tomar's led bar.

May not be a bad idea for general traffic clearing ability. Whelen's LED bars are highly effective; you'd be suprised how bright they can be at night. Also, depending on the lightbar, it might be possible to move the roof decal to the top of the lightbar.

Whelen also makes a lightbar with a LED graphics board on the back that can be used for traffic advising as well as word messages. Caveat is that it has to be programmed ahead of time.

[LMRDesigner]

I'd have to vote for the Whelen LED products over the Tomar. Based on my experience with them, they are better designed and brighter than what Tomar has out. The B-Link siren/lightbar system from Whelen is worth every penny if you can afford it.

The latest 911EP LED technology beats them all though--in terms of brightness and small size.

Combine all those individual speakers into one. Check out this little combiner/amplifier.

http://www.fleetradioproducts.com/4AMP-03.htm

I've used them several times in fire trucks and command vehicles just like the one you've got. They work great.

-LMD

[tvsjr]

I'd have to vote for the Whelen LED products over the Tomar. Based on my experience with them, they are better designed and brighter than what Tomar has out. The B-Link siren/lightbar system from Whelen is worth every penny if you can afford it.

The latest 911EP LED technology beats them all though--in terms of brightness and small size.

Combine all those individual speakers into one. Check out this little combiner/amplifier.

http://www.fleetradioproducts.com/4AMP-03.htm

I've used them several times in fire trucks and command vehicles just like the one you've got. They work great.

-LMD

Four posts to this board, and you've made 3 recommendations for the Fleet Radio Products speaker combiner. You say you're in Dallas, the company lists in Duncanville. Can you say corporate shill, boys and girls?

[Cowboy]

I'd have to vote for the Whelen LED products over the Tomar. Based on my experience with them, they are better designed and brighter than what Tomar has out. The B-Link siren/lightbar system from Whelen is worth every penny if you can afford it.

The latest 911EP LED technology beats them all though--in terms of brightness and small size.

Combine all those individual speakers into one. Check out this little combiner/amplifier.

http://www.fleetradioproducts.com/4AMP-03.htm

I've used them several times in fire trucks and command vehicles just like the one you've got. They work great.

-LMD

Four posts to this board, and you've made 3 recommendations for the Fleet Radio Products speaker combiner. You say you're in Dallas, the company lists in Duncanville. Can you say corporate shill, boys and girls?

I was about to say something there...

Yes it does look like a nice product but honestly I started in the mobile venue audio field (large scale dances/sporting events) then moved on to mobile audio installation then finally in to vehicle electronics (emergency lighting/communications/etc). For the cost, I've built 3-4 units that allowed for 8 channels of audio with an audio equalizer for each channel. For some reason my low band Maratrac just had the bassiest audio ever! Nice notch at 75 hz fixed that problem.

[tvsjr]

I'd have to vote for the Whelen LED products over the Tomar. Based on my experience with them, they are better designed and brighter than what Tomar has out. The B-Link siren/lightbar system from Whelen is worth every penny if you can afford it.

The latest 911EP LED technology beats them all though--in terms of brightness and small size.

Combine all those individual speakers into one. Check out this little combiner/amplifier.

http://www.fleetradioproducts.com/4AMP-03.htm

I've used them several times in fire trucks and command vehicles just like the one you've got. They work great.

-LMD

Four posts to this board, and you've made 3 recommendations for the Fleet Radio Products speaker combiner. You say you're in Dallas, the company lists in Duncanville. Can you say corporate shill, boys and girls?

I was about to say something there...

Yes it does look like a nice product but honestly I started in the mobile venue audio field (large scale dances/sporting events) then moved on to mobile audio installation then finally in to vehicle electronics (emergency lighting/communications/etc). For the cost, I've built 3-4 units that allowed for 8 channels of audio with an audio equalizer for each channel. For some reason my low band Maratrac just had the bassiest audio ever! Nice notch at 75 hz fixed that problem.

Hmm, got any schematics? Honestly, the Fleet Radio box looks pretty cool - I'm looking for something similar for my new truck. However, I refuse to buy from companies with such shady business practices.

[LMRDesigner]

Cowboy wrote:
tvsjr wrote:
Four posts to this board, and you've made 3 recommendations for the Fleet Radio Products speaker combiner. You say you're in Dallas, the company lists in Duncanville. Can you say corporate shill, boys and girls?

<snip>

Hmm, got any schematics? Honestly, the Fleet Radio box looks pretty cool - I'm looking for something similar for my new truck. However, I refuse to buy from companies with such shady business practices.

I'm sorry that you feel that way. I am just trying to get the word out. Top notch installers, like many readers of this board, are the people who stand to benefit the most from a product such as this. If you developed a niche product that solved some problem of mine, I would want to hear about it.

I won't give out schematics for obvious reasons, but I will stand behind all performance claims. There are literally hundreds of these installed throughout the US, and I think that speaks volumes about its effectiveness. I am confident customers will be fully satisfied, or I will refund their money--including shipping.

I apologize if I have offended anyone.

Brad Cobo, Owner
Fleet Radio Products, LLC.
Username LMRDesigner
Phone 214-587-8606

[tvsjr]

I'm sorry that you feel that way. I am just trying to get the word out. Top notch installers, like many readers of this board, are the people who stand to benefit the most from a product such as this. If you developed a niche product that solved some problem of mine, I would want to hear about it.

I won't give out schematics for obvious reasons, but I will stand behind all performance claims. There are literally hundreds of these installed throughout the US, and I think that speaks volumes about its effectiveness. I am confident customers will be fully satisfied, or I will refund their money--including shipping.

I apologize if I have offended anyone.

Brad Cobo, Owner
Fleet Radio Products, LLC.
Username LMRDesigner
Phone 214-587-8606

First, I wasn't asking you for schematics - I was asking Cowboy, since it sounds like he's built similar devices in the past.

However, you miss the point of our complaints. There are several members of this board who do some advertising for their commercial ventures. However, they are completely up-front about their interests (see Jeff at Waltel, Station House Products, kc7gr and Blue Feather Technologies, etc.) They also contribute valuable technical know-how that doesn't directly benefit them or their business.

Compare this to how you did things. You showed up and attempted to promote your own product under the guise of being some satisfied end user. Unfortunately, you failed to realize the observation skills of some of the users, and got called on it. Now, it looks like you have a pretty cool product, albeit a tad bit on the spendy side. However, such shady tactics will alienate lots of potential customers (and, you're right, there are *lots* of potential customers here).

I will give you a bit of credit for having the balls to admit what you did rather than either disappear or refute our accusations.

[Res168cue]

is that a 800 Mhz Astro (digital) MCS2000 I see in the photo in the pickup??? to my knowledge MCS2000s were not APCO compliant... let me know thanks!

[Bob]

is that a 800 Mhz Astro (digital) MCS2000 I see in the photo in the pickup??? to my knowledge MCS2000s were not APCO compliant... let me know thanks!

That's either a MCS2000, which IS analog only, or a SouthernLink radio, which is iDen digital. Hunstville / Madison County has a bretty decent smartnet system. SoLink is still going strong in a lot of areas.

Scott:
I'd give my blessing on the 911EP equipment, as long as it's all red. I've found that their amber and blue are a little on the weak side. Their red wipes the floor with any other LED product I've seen. I have reservations on the Tomar controller, only because I've never worked on one. I've installed Fed Sig SmartSirens and Whelen CenComs - and am absolutely thrilled with the CenCom. If you can afford it, I'd say that's the way to go.

I'm not excited about the LCS. I cut my teeth on the Spectra, and then the MCS2000. But if it works for you, go for it. Do you guys do much work with Redstone or Marshal? If so, a decent trunk-tracking scanner that will do smartnet on UHF wouldn't be a bad idea either.


Stay tuned for a couple PMs - I just applied for a job with HPD and have some questions about the area.

[tvsjr]

is that a 800 Mhz Astro (digital) MCS2000 I see in the photo in the pickup??? to my knowledge MCS2000s were not APCO compliant... let me know thanks!

That's a SouthernLINC iDEN digital radio... can't remember the model number (PM3000?) Anyway, it's based around the MCS2000 but has black buttons.

Remember, boys and girls, digital != APCO P25 (not always, anyway!)

[emcom]

That's either a ......., or a SouthernLink radio, which is iDen digital. Hunstville / Madison County has a bretty decent smartnet system. SoLink is still going strong in a lot of areas.

Right, Bob, that is in fact a Southern Linc Iden Mobile. Our Police Dept does run the Analog MCS2000's whick look similar w/no keypad....just have the dial button there instead.

Scott:
I'd give my blessing on the 911EP equipment, as long as it's all red. I've found that their amber and blue are a little on the weak side.

Bob, right again....Our Sheriff Dept uses the blue version and they do seem weaker to me. That concerned me initially. We will be using all red.

Their red wipes the floor with any other LED product I've seen. I have reservations on the Tomar controller, only because I've never worked on one. I've installed Fed Sig SmartSirens and Whelen CenComs - and am absolutely thrilled with the CenCom. If you can afford it, I'd say that's the way to go.

I'm not excited about the LCS. I cut my teeth on the Spectra, and then the MCS2000. But if it works for you, go for it. Do you guys do much work with Redstone or Marshal? If so, a decent trunk-tracking scanner that will do smartnet on UHF wouldn't be a bad idea either.


Stay tuned for a couple PMs - I just applied for a job with HPD and have some questions about the area.

Be glad to talk to you about Huntsville!

We don't communicate with RSA or NASA much on the radio. They both have our 800 Smartnet installed to communicate with us if needed. Off air, we communicate often. We do have a weeky radio test.

EMA's primary workhorse is Southern Linc. All EMA's in the state have them. We operate on VHF, UHF, and the smartnet system too - just depends on who we are talking too and where we are at. We used to be 100% smartnet users until we got everyone a linc a couple of years ago. They are smaller, lighter, and we can talk from one end of the state to the other with them.....for a price, of course.

VHF is primarily for the benefit of the county users with vhf in their cars, fire engines, etc. Also some agencies on the smartnet kept their vhf repeaters active for backup use. We held on to a lot of that stuff. The 3 PD repeaters were kept. We have all 3. Ham repeater, ham backup, and EMA public safety band repeater. All are Micors.

Scott

[Cowboy]

is that a 800 Mhz Astro (digital) MCS2000 I see in the photo in the pickup??? to my knowledge MCS2000s were not APCO compliant... let me know thanks!

That's a SouthernLINC iDEN digital radio... can't remember the model number (PM3000?) Anyway, it's based around the MCS2000 but has black buttons.

That would be the LM3000e... Nice little mobile but still only 3 watts...
http://www.southernlinc.com/lm3000e.asp